Quirky - that is what I am talking about

[Dave Pitman]

Part of my point here is that CA should contain better 2D tools, since Vectorworks and Autocad/Revit have great 2D tools for the architectural practice. CA needs a rich 2D tool set with the sharp printing to go with it. Add a new UI, and CA is hands down the best BIM/CAD app on the market.

So, you are saying that you would prefer to draw this using strickly CAD tools, and not object based tools, irregardless of how long it takes?

That doesn't make sense to me, but then I have never drawn elevations using strictly CAD, why would I want to?

I wouldn't expect CA to go in the direction you suggest any time soon. Just my opinion.

[johnnyprc]

So, you are saying that you would prefer to draw this using strickly CAD tools, and not object based tools, irregardless of how long it takes?

That doesn't make sense to me, but then I have never drawn elevations using strictly CAD, why would I want to?

I wouldn't expect CA to go in the direction you suggest any time soon. Just my opinion.

There is an art to architecture. True to form, those who practice the full art will inevitably create better drawings, and structures.

The freedom to draw in 2D, whether by hand or computer, makes it so your design is not limited by the CAD tool. I could never start with a 3D design and expect to model fast enough for my creativity to flow through that process – except in mass modeling with something like sketchup. We are taught that in school, and we appreciate the artistic/creative form to our profession and seek tools to match.

Attached is a project I did, and you can see the example of the 2d hand drawings which inspire the 3d modeling. I think the end result was better in the model, since I was able to quickly assess the changes I wanted to make. If I started with the model, my laziness would have probably prevented me from going back and changing it all... =)

[sutcac]

I could never start with a 3D design and expect to model fast enough for my creativity to flow through that process – except in mass modeling with something like sketchup. We are taught that in school, and we appreciate the artistic/creative form to our profession and seek tools to match.

Attached is a project I did, and you can see the example of the 2d hand drawings which inspire the 3d modeling. I think the end result was better in the model, since I was able to quickly assess the changes I wanted to make. If I started with the model, my laziness would have probably prevented me from going back and changing it all... =)

I think it's just about a paradigm shift. While I did learn some of these same things in school, I pretty much skipped completely over 2D CAD drafting entirely and went right to 3D way back when Chief started out as Home Designer 3D Deluxe (or whatever it was). So, I just don't see the tool as limiting my creativity. Indeed, it allows much more time for DESIGN and much less time for "drafting" the design.

As I said, you could nitpick the PDF I posted (which you did) but more careful mastery over line weight in your profile plan layersets, perhaps a little bit of CAD overlay in the vector view, and some Edit Layout (look it up) after you send the view to Layout and you would be right where you want to be with line weights etc. It's just about mastering the tools and getting over the inertia of being set in your ways.

[IRISH]

There is an art to architecture. True to form, those who practice the full art will inevitably create better drawings, and structures.

The freedom to draw in 2D, whether by hand or computer, makes it so your design is not limited by the CAD tool. I could never start with a 3D design and expect to model fast enough for my creativity to flow through that process – except in mass modeling with something like sketchup. We are taught that in school, and we appreciate the artistic/creative form to our profession and seek tools to match.

Attached is a project I did, and you can see the example of the 2d hand drawings which inspire the 3d modeling. I think the end result was better in the model, since I was able to quickly assess the changes I wanted to make. If I started with the model, my laziness would have probably prevented me from going back and changing it all... =)

Johnny,

I understand what you are saying. I too begin with a basic concept in my mind and I flesh it out- one line at a time. It is within that process that the creativity comes out and begins to show itself. Then, the 3D model is created and the form is finalized.

I can relate because I still design in 2D. Trying to create a design with 3D "objects" just doesn't work real well for me. It is an entirely different way of thinking that I still can't grasp. I guess what I am saying is there are different ways of approaching anything, as we all know, and this is a classic example. Plus, I too would like to know how to better do the lineweight control where needed without creating yet more layers, annosets, etc.

[rcole]

Thanks for the pics and the description of the point you have been trying to make.

One thing I would like to point out is that many of the folks that have responded to your OP are very experienced with CA and find modeling in CA second nature. Considering this, it makes the idea of creating concepts in 2D a bit of a hard sell.

One thing that comes to mind from your comments is that since you are using mulitple CAD applications it makes it harder to appreciate CA's CAD tools since they are cut from a bit of a different cloth than your more traditional apps.

There are many features that I find quite helpful in CA, such as the multicopy tool. Sometimes they hit the mark and sometimes not so much. It appears to me that in their attempt to simplify the CAD tools they have at times created a monster in such things as automatic snapping to create polylines and dimensions that try to out think the user.

The basic tools have worked in the past, and so far as I know are still working quite well for creating lines and dimensions in a traditional sense. If I am hearing you correctly, you are making the point that it may be of benefit to everyone if CA were to move in the direction of being a little more main stream than they have been in the past with their CAD tools?

But, no deal on creating concepts from 2D elevations from my perspective. Creating the model and publishing views from the model are more in line with my thinking on the matter. I do appreciate your input on such things as editing elevation lines for better printing and presentations.

This has been a very interesting thread.