Architectual warning

[AdamF]

Originally posted by jwrjr
Regarding "unstamped" plans, most locations in our area do not require stamps for basic homes. This is only required in certain zones; typically velocity zones due to hurricanes.

I agree with everything you said... including the parts I cut. Actually, I thought for a moment that you might be living my life over.

I think you will find that in most cases where a seal is required an engineer's seal is valid and often preferred. Check you state and local codes.

If anyone wants "tonage" I can give you a good link that should fill your every need.

The "Light Construction Thesaurus" defines "tonage" as:
A) A waste of time.
B) A sick joke.
C) A way to give the appearance of actually doing something.

Cheers
It's Friday.

AF

[ram16821]

In the final analysis, regardless of one's title, if you have a job in this industry, your paid participation is evidence of your ecomonic viability, which in turn justifies your position.

For every commercial building erected in any given year, there's no doubt hundreds if not thousands of residences.

In short, there's obviously room for everyone.

And "cheers" indeed -- it's Friday : )

[VHampton]

jwrjr,

I agree with your post. All the education in the world does not make a designer, or the at the very least a good architect. I have a hands-on construction background which was an invaluable experience. And something that everyone in the residential design business should undergo in my opinion. I am still to this day astounded at some of the questions and comments I observe from colleagues. But not all architects are pompous, arrogant, egocentric know-it-alls. Some of us still wear construction boots, drive 4 x4 's, and have coffee breaks with the framers at the job sites. As you mentioned in your earlier posts, there are more than a few who certainly give us a bad rap. Those are the ones who won't get hired to do more work. And they'll cry foul as they sit in the corner of someone else's firm writing bathroom spec.s We can only hope.

Lord knows I've seen many of the suit and tie wanna-bees coming from the city asking how to get big commissions in "Hamptons". I tell them to stick to store front window displays in Manhattan.

[spencerdesign]

jwrjr,

I hope your "Architect" ends up sitting in the corner of someone else's firm writing bathroom spec's. I feel your pain. I recently experienced similar with an "Engineer" selected by an Owner. Being someone else’s employee long enough to qualify to take a multiple choice test by no means makes them competent.

I should have qualified my previous post to include the term "reputable" and "experienced". A qualified and successful Architect can bring more to the table than someone that just draws. I am sorry about your experience, but don't let one bad apple spoil the whole bunch of girls.

As always, Buyer Beware!

Sam

[AdamF]

I agree with the last three posts too.

I put the smiley there but I am serious. Very!

We aren't as far apart as might first appear, are we?

AF

[Pendu]

Friends of this forum:

With all my respects, to all the people who is not an Architect, and want to be called or named as such, go to the university and earn your title.
I spend a lot of money, time an effort to achieve this goal and I don't like when other people use the name architect to look more professional or important in their bussiness.

have a nice day !!!

JC Pizzo
licensed architect and urbanist

[Don Randall]

Hi all.
This has been an interesting thread to read. Thought I would provide my 2 cents worth.

I am a retired engineer (BS in Ocean Engineering and MS in Structural Engineering). I started "residential design" work as a hobby; some retirees like to garden, do oil painting, but I decided to do residential design work for local designers. I started with Chief and that is the major design tool I use ( I do use SketchUp for some areas).

I have an Architect buddy who allows me to train in his firm while I am working on an Architectural degree. You see, I got hooked on architectural design and decided to learn more (continue my education) not to mention this residential design hobby has an $$ income to supplement retirement.

So given that background and the subject of this thread, would it be OK to say I am an "Architect in Training"? or just a "Guy aiding in residential and light commerical design who loves architecture and drives university professors crazy with first principles questions about architectural design?

Don

[cadstudio]

This is a very interesting thread. I think someone said earlier the key to the issue - there's room for everyone. And why? Well, I think the clients determine that. Just like everything else in life you usually get what you pay for.

If I want to get home from the airport I have options - I could walk, I could take a cab, I could rent a car or I could take a limo. I decide which way I'll go. Not the limo driver or the car rental company.

This is in essence the issue. The clients decide who they are willing to work with on their projects. Not a word... (such as architect or technician or draftsperson).

How many houses have I seen built without 'PROPERLY' designed and drawn up plans - many! Who has commited this 'crime' - all! - Some architects, some technicians and some drafstpersons. The reality of it is that we all can make mistakes; regardless of the measures we take to limit them.

I have the utmost respect for the craft. If an individual has gone through the required process then they should be rewarded. But don't try to force the public - or clients - to reward you for your own purpose by making them attain your services and your services 'only'. Hey, the average person only wants to take the cab.

As for the term Architectural I think as long as you don't use it to misrepresent what you are and do its OK to use it. But at the end of the day the law prevails. In my country I can't even use the word design or designer much less architectural. But this doesn't stop me from being a productive NECESSARY element of the process.

People come to me as a draftsperson because they don't want to take the 'limo'. They either can't afford it or don't think its necessary. However, though I may not be a nice shinny limo I can still get them home and in time.

Even experienced architects retain my services over that of a junior architect because they don't want to pay the 2-3% for his/her fees.

[jwrjr]

Cadstudio:
Very nicely put. You have found a great way to analyze the situation as a whole.

Pendu:
I never tried to represent myself as an architect. My only point was that architects are overkill in most residential situations and not many owners can afford to pay the fees for basic house. Stay calm and reward yourself in whatever you can. Just try not hurt the "little" guy.

As I said before, and Cadstudio was most generous to second, there is room for everyone. It shouldn't get to the point that a person MUST pay thousands of dollars for plans just to build an 1800 sq. ft. home to shelter their family. Once again, I have great respect for architects, in general, and feel that they are most definitely needed in the industry. But as I said above, there is a place for everyone without killing the industry or the small guys trying to make a living.

I'm not here to upset anyone. Just making points on recent experiences. Most of you seem to agree and that is a refreshing thing to see.

Have a great weekend, everyone.

[silverhammer]

to JC Pizzo and others,

I agree that if you go to shcool and pay the big price you deserve the title architect, as does a doctor , lawyer, or engineer. and I or my frined never have put them selves out to be an architect as many here do not.
But to be honest, going by all the books, dictionaries etc, I do do architectural drawings. Find me a book , other then one produced by an architect or an archtiect school that syas, architectrual means work only done by architects
Howver to avoid a lawsuit I do avoid the terms architectural now as well

I too respect a lot of architects and ther abilites and vision
and as posted here many times ther are many designers with the same or better or worse abilites and vision

Many of us go by varius other titles too, yet I haqvent gotten in trouble with other orgainizations yet.

I have been called a framing magician, for being able to frame complicated roof structres other said could not be done. no magicinas are after me
I amd a general contractor, yet my 2nd leutenatn son does not salute me, yet if I had a hand in it we would nt be sending relatives to Iraq ( have two over there )

Lastly and amusing littel side note. When a very young kid I was so excited my grandfater was an engineer
I remeber the hurtful day that I was told he had nothing to do with driving trains

[JJohnson]

Here on Sonoma County California, the county guide to the code book states "anyone may draw plans for a residence of not more then two stories". Then, if you can make it fairly simple in design, that is "conventional" construction, you may not need structural engineering.

There was a nice article on design in the latest issue of Journal of Light Construction. You can download it for 3 $ at

http://www.jlconline.com/cgi-bin/jlc.../View/0406desi

I think we contractors turned residential drafters can benefit from from ideas like this, and if anyone can suggest good books on building design principles, I would be interested

[mthd]

To all Architects out There

The term Architect is mainly used to mean a construction designer of buildings that can be of any type unlimited in stories.

Architectural Draftsperson just draws other peoples designs.

Architectural technicians work for Architects.

Residential Architectural designers, Designs & Draws the building.

Residential Architect Designs, draws & supervises the job for a percentage of the construction cost, usualy up to 3 stories.

Idustrial Architect, deigns, draws & supervises for a %age idustrial buildings.

Low Rise Commercial Architect.

Medium rise Residential appartments & motels architect

High rise Residential appartments & hotels

High Rise Commercial Architects

A true Architect can do all these jobs with great proficiency
and use all the design techniques to do so.

But he is Nothing without an Engineer & a Builder to make his dream design a reality.

But then again any Artist can come up with a fancy concept form or sculpture and will need an achitect to set out rooms.

Most Important Who gave you the ability to design. only one person can take the credit for that "The Creator"and all men and women are capabable of becoming architects under the right circumstances. Architect is just a job not a fancy title that deifys the person who has that qualification.

[spencerdesign]

I guess I am an Architectural Draftsman then. But I’ve been scared away from the term. Could call it an identity crisis I suppose. Just had to keep this one alive .

Sam

[RMorrison]

Originally posted by spencerdesign
I guess I am an Architectural Draftsman then. But I’ve been scared away from the term. <snip>Sam

Sam, you're probably right to feel a little nervous about using this term. Here's what the California Architects Practice Act says...


§ 5536 Practice Without License or Holding Self Out as Architect; Misdemeanor

(a) It is a misdemeanor, punishable by a fine of not less than one hundred dollars ($100) nor more than five thousand
dollars ($5,000), or by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year, or by both that fine and imprisonment, for
any person who is not licensed to practice architecture under this chapter, to practice architecture in this state, to use any
term confusingly similar to the word architect, to use the stamp of a licensed architect, as provided in Section 5536.1, or
to advertise or put out any sign, card, or other device that might indicate to the public that he or she is an architect, that
he or she is qualified to engage in the practice of architecture, or that he or she is an architectural designer."


Full text at www.cab.ca.gov

To mthd: while your definitions may be useful to yourself, in the State of California, the term "architect" is binary. Either you are or you aren't. From the State's point of view, there are no "grades" or "types" of architects.

[spencerdesign]

Got It!

I have never claimed to be an Architect. I just wanted to serve one. I promise to never use the term Architectural again.

Sam