sorry - yet another question - steching zones

[Joe Carrick]

Gerry & Scott,

I don't have a problem with the "Toilet Bounding Box". I set it at 30"x60" and the walls are limited in placement so that the bounding box space is not violated. Are you guys seeing something different?

[dshall]

Gerry & Scott,

I don't have a problem with the "Toilet Bounding Box". I set it at 30"x60" and the walls are limited in placement so that the bounding box space is not violated. Are you guys seeing something different?

Joe, I was not trying to change this for the toilet for any particular reason. I just wanted to know how I would change it for any symbol, the electrical symbol in particular.

[Joe Carrick]

Scott,

So what exactly do you want the electrical symbol to do?

[dshall]

Scott,

So what exactly do you want the electrical symbol to do?

Mount correctly to the base cabinet.

[gteacher]

Gerry & Scott,

I don't have a problem with the "Toilet Bounding Box". I set it at 30"x60" and the walls are limited in placement so that the bounding box space is not violated. Are you guys seeing something different?

In general terms, this is called an exercise in “splitting hairs”. Here’s the problem noticed. The bounding box is used to create a free zone around the toilet. The free space should be all around the toilet – 21” in front, 15” on center sides and approx. 2” in back to allow for the tank top access. You cannot get the 2” in back to snap uniformly.

To do so you have to offset the origin in neg direction and resize the bounding box. You can do this, and it shows correctly in 3D but not 2D since the 2D symbol bounding box resizes to the exact dims of the symbol and vice versa. You can place a rect around the symbol to “fake out” the bounding box generation, but it then shows in the symbol. Therefore if the origin is set negative, the 2D symbol will not be representative. Bounding box dims are always positive from the origin. There is no way to create a 2D CAD symbol bounding box that is bigger than the 2D graphics since the bounding box in 2D is automatic - TIKO.

[Joe Carrick]

In theory, we should be able to adjust the 2D Block origin offset in CAD Block Management. However, as you say, it doesn't result in the Bounding Box moving as it should. So I'd say that you are correct in that there's a bug (functional) in how it's working at this time. Maybe the solution should just be an addition to the Symbol dbx to allow the Bounding Box to be moved as needed.

[sutcac]

An offset bounding box would really help when laying out handicapped accessible bathrooms.

[dshall]

An offset bounding box would really help when laying out handicapped accessible bathrooms.

Interesting, been awhile since I have done a handicap bathroom. So if you need more distance on one side than the other, you are correct, offsetted bounding boxes could be useful. If you need same clearance on each side but just bigger, we can already do that.

[Joe Carrick]

OK, so I'm thinking OOB.

We can cause the 2D Block to be offset - with a little ingenuity. As an example I will use the ADA Toilet.

1. Place the Symbol in a Plan
2. Using CAD Block Management Place the corresponding CAD Block off to the side
3. Unblock the CAD Block
4. Add a small circle(1/16" diam) 1" above the existing geometry (centered in the x direction)
5. Select that circle and the existing Geometry and Block it - make sure the Block is on the correct Layer and that you name it so you can identify it.
6. Select the Symbol and open the Symbol dbx - assign the revised CAD Block as the 2D Block for the Symbol. Go to the Sizing Tab and increase the y size of the Bounding Box to 60".

The result will be that the Bounding Box will be 2'6" x 60" and will be offset 1". You will of course see the short line that you added but it's going to be coincidental with the wall surface so it isn't a problem.

This essentially means that when you place the Toilet up against a wall it will be located 1" from the wall in Plan View. You will probably want to adjust the Symbol Origin (y=-1") as well so the 2D and 3D are coordinated.

ps: Just because we can do this doesn't mean that I don't think CA should fix it so that the Bounding Box location is automatically compatible with the 3D Symbol Origin. I have consistently said that the 2D representation of Symbols should always be consistent with the 3D Symbol.

Note: I really should give Gerry credit for sparking this idea. He suggested a possibility of placing a Rectangle around the CAD Block to position the 2D Block - but mentioned that it would be visible. Using a small circle gives the same result without being a problem.

[Joe Carrick]

BTW,

If you go to all the trouble to make these changes then make sure you add this symbol to your User Library so you can use it in the future instead of the one that CA provided.

Adrean, if you read this you might want to look at fixing the existing toilet symbols in the Library. Currently the 3D y origin is offset -1/2" but it should probably be -1" and the 2D Block should be offset - 1". This would make the 2D Block and the 3D Symbol be in concert with each other.

[Joe Carrick]

It's also possible to place such points (the little circles) to either side of the toilet aligned with the back wall to cause the Bounding Box to be offset laterally. IOW, place one 15" left of center and another 27" right of center. This would result in a bounding box 42" wide and the Toilet offset within the Bounding Box. Don't forget to adjust the Symbol origin so that the 3D Symbol is coincidental with the 2D Block.

[Joe Carrick]

I opened the symbol dbx of the ADA Toilet (X6 OOB) and it's origin is shown as x=0, y=-1/2", z=0.
I called SSA Support and the Tech says that his shows x=0, y=0, z=0.

How can that be? Does anyone else have a value of y=0?

BTW, IMO the value should be y = -1" so that the back of the toilet is 1" from the wall.

[kenoeightspot]

Mine is 0,0,0

[Joe Carrick]

Mine is 0,0,0

Interesting, How did I get one that's set at -1/2"? AFAIK, there's no way that we can edit that in the Library.

[kenoeightspot]

The ADA Toilet in X5 is Y=-1/2"
Did you copy the X5 lib files to X6 somehow.