headers interior framing??

[johnnyprc]

So I was reading another post that was criticizing CA for placing the wrong headers in pocket doors. At first I couldn't understand the relevance of the issue, since other than exterior doors or a pocket door on a bearing wall, there wouldn't be any special header for any interior framed wall. Then, it hit me that Chief frames ALL doors with headers, regardless whether they are interior or on a bearing wall - I then tried it and sure enough, EVERY door has a header.

Is there a way to turn this off for interior walls (except bearing)? That is not right.

[dshall]

Every opening needs a header, the question is how large. Need a DBX so we can define header size for every opening.

[johnnyprc]

If you mean "any" framing member for the term "header" than yes, but most the time that member is simply a corresponding 2x plate sized (single) lintel - not even turned on edge - with 2x framing vertically framed to the top plate(s). I guess you could say its a header, but I don't call that out in any way as a header on my plans so as not to cause confusion when I do want a header in a bearing wall line (specifically).

Yes, we need to be able to set headers per door - however, the "default" for interior framed walls (unless its called out as a bearing line) should be framed with a plate lintel, and vertical framing above. That's how its really framed most the time in the field.

In fact, here is a detail used for interior double pocket door:

http://www.johnsonhardware.com/image...NVERGINGRO.jpg

[Mattyt12]

Every opening needs a header, the question is how large. Need a DBX so we can define header size for every opening.

and maybe take it one step further and have header size automatically generated by the opening size or span via user defined parameters.

[dshall]

It is still a header. We should have he ability to size as we see fit. How accurate can a cut list be if CA is specing 4x6 when we know a flat 2x4 will work.

[dshall]

and maybe take it one step further and have header size automatically generated by the opening size or span via user defined parameters.

Of course that would be the ultimate goal, (can already do that to some extent), but I know that if I have a 4' opening, but I have a girder truss sitting on it, a 4x4 won't work, I may need a 4x12. We cannot make that change.

[johnnyprc]

It is still a header. We should have he ability to size as we see fit. How accurate can a cut list be if CA is specing 4x6 when we know a flat 2x4 will work.

LOL - I guess we can call it whatever - you call it a header, and I will call it a lintel plate. Since a lot of my plans contain language like "ALL HEADERS TO BE "XYZ" UNO", I wouldn't want to have to make additional references to cover interior door framing not on a bearing line/load. I can tell you framers in the field don't commonly refer to that as a header - at least around here. In fact, I was a project today where the framer asked me: "do any of these interior walls have headers?"...and he meant: "is there an interior bearing line?". You are correct though, it is a header regardless.

I think control over these areas is mandatory for Chief to add. Regardless of term, the fact is how we frame exterior walls is nearly ALWAYS different than how we treat non-bearing interior walls. Chief is not showing this correct at all.

[johnnyprc]

I just looked it up - its called a "head trimmer". I guess that makes more sense, since most the time when you place a beam header in, you would still need the head trimmer. So in many ways its really NOT a header if we want Chief to frame the condition correctly. Yes, some still call it a header, but when you use an actual beam member for a header, you still want/need the head trimmer in addition (framed the same orientation as the plate).

Chief should have that head trimmer in as an option - PLUS a header or NO header for interior walls, with jack stud framing above.

Some may think this isn't necessary, but for all the people who want Chief to provide build accurate models that detail properly for every region (since there is variation), this level of discussion is required.

[dshall]

I just looked it up - its called a "head trimmer". I guess that makes more sense, since most the time when you place a beam header in that area, you would still need the head trimmer. So in many ways it really IS NOT a header in reality.

Chief should have that head trimmer in as an option - PLUS a header or NO header for interior walls.

I don't think it matters what we call it. The point is there is a piece of lumber over the opening, and we should be able to define the size, for several reasons, one being able to get a more accurate lumber cut list.

[johnnyprc]

Yes, I agree it doesn't matter what we call it. But we need that trimmer to be an option to frame in. We often frame that trimmer below a beam header for several reasons - and Chief just doesn't show it - or have an option to show that trimmer. I used to be able to spec a 6x header beam on my exterior walls, but energy code doesn't permit that any longer. So that trimmer exists even WITH the beam in most cases. I'll try to find a picture to illustrate.

[Mattyt12]

I know this is off topic but it always interests me the different building methodologies of other countries and pine framing that isnt blue?

[johnnyprc]

I know this is off topic but it always interests me the different building methodologies of other countries and pine framing that isnt blue?

That is treated wood for fungal issues they have in tropical environments. I've spec'd similar things in homes I've done in Hawaii and China. Although in China 90% of the home is concrete - even the roof is a vaulted concrete pour.

[Mattyt12]

Its treated yes but its used to deter termites, along with the orange damp proof course looking stuff

[johnnyprc]

Yes, it does deter termites too, but its primarily for the fungus and mold in those environments.

http://www.bluwood.com/

[Allen42acj]

There is a place in framing defaults to change the header size.
That's not the same as what you want though....