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Thread: Materials List Revisited
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03-30-2013, 03:03 AM #1
Edward,
That is not how the Slab Pour Number is designed to work, so no, I can't get it to do that.
The Slab Pour Number only applies to monolithic slabs and is applied on a room by room basis.
This means it can't be use for the level 2 slab - the level 2 slab is separated by floor number anyway.
I can divide the level 1 floor into 2 rooms and apply a different pour number to each - this is how it is meant to work.
In this case, the concrete is reported separately for the footings, pour 1 (level 1), pour 2 (level 1) and level 2 slab.Glenn
Chief X5
www.glennwoodward.com.au
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03-30-2013, 01:35 AM #2
Glen asked for specifics. Actually they come in in drabs every so often (do a search). Its just that no one pays any attention because most don't use a useless function. Also most builder know how to build and price residential housing. They generally won't use anything unless there's some degree of confidence in it.
A five minute review?
Chief Architect Material List
1. Trim only reported as 1x ? regardless of size or style
2. Sills report as 1x3 regardless of size or style. Lintels not reported
3. No molding style reported except for room base, chair & crown
4. Insulation given as batts only.
5. Walls panels not identified.
6. No way to list accessory material such as: nails, drywall/floor screws, tape, mortar, ties, forming, damp proofing, exp joints, caulking, shims, flashing, clips, etc.
7. No way to break down, plumbing, electrical, HVAC
8. No way to insert lines for eng, permits, inspections, architectural, etc.
9. No material excavation.
10. No method to separately list concrete for footing, walls, curbs, location
11. Trusses listed by number only.
12. No landscaping such as seed, top soil, edging, etc. not possible –gardens listed.
13. No identification of rafters by use: ridge, hip, valley, blocking,
14. No way to identify phases or dates.
15. Gutters and others not identified by size or style
16. Shingles by area only. Cals by one formula only
17. All formulas by Chief only.
18. All grouping by Chief only.
19. No accumulation of paint totals or other similar materials
20. No reporting of driveways and sidewalksGerry
NewCraft Home Services
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If the Government would just cut down more d*** trees, I'd have a much better view of the forest.
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03-30-2013, 02:28 AM #3Ed_Downunder
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That's a good review for only 5 minutes.
It does explain why so many abandon the materials list.
Really appreciate your input Gerry. A lot of people are looking at this issue and following this conversation.
If you are a user that would like to use the materials list but have not for any reason please join in and contribute your thoughts.
It's not about your knowledge or lack of it. It's about a feature that needs fixing and Chief need's to know that a large user base wants it fixed.Edward
CA X6 Beta
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Intermediate skill set and reaching
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03-30-2013, 03:56 AM #4Ed_Downunder
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Thanks Glen for looking at this. You have reported cubic meters for a footing. That surprised me because I cant report that unless I make my wall a foundation wall. I have included a screen shot to explain.
Do you think that having pours for different rooms is a sensible use. I can see an application for a garage bit not a house. This is the point really. At first look it looks good. In practice where is the value.Edward
CA X6 Beta
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03-30-2013, 04:21 AM #5Ed_Downunder
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Tried to attach and I inserted instead!!! help appreciated.
The wall that is reporting is the foundation wall.( Verticore is a local brick)
Why is it reporting 220 brick & 240 bricks it just a straight foundation wall demonstrating the footing
The mesh is reporting 25 sq m. Look at the slab it is inside the 5m perimeter wall.
The footing is reporting with the slab. There is less than 25 sq m of 100 mm concrete so it should be less than 2.5 cubic meters of concrete.Edward
CA X6 Beta
Designer
Intermediate skill set and reaching
PPCM Pace Project & Construction Management.
www.ppcm.com.au
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03-30-2013, 05:09 AM #6
Post the plan for comment
Gerry
NewCraft Home Services
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If the Government would just cut down more d*** trees, I'd have a much better view of the forest.
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03-30-2013, 05:55 AM #7Ed_Downunder
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Hi Gerry,
How can I post the plan file. Have looked on FAQ can't find anything.
I looked at my walls in 3d and the brick returns to close the cavity. Not bothered about it at this time now I know the reason why.
But the mesh is still reporting 25 sq m.
I saw in another post about window sills. How would that report? Length is OK for a stone sill but a brick sill are solids and should report as a brick count.Edward
CA X6 Beta
Designer
Intermediate skill set and reaching
PPCM Pace Project & Construction Management.
www.ppcm.com.au
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03-30-2013, 01:49 PM #8Registered User Promoted
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You could email me the plan as I have spent a bit time with material list and have discovered a couple of tricks that may be of interest to that's if you haven't already figured them out
Email house3d@gmail.comLast edited by Mark; 03-30-2013 at 01:58 PM.
Mark Brehaut , Manager
3D Virtual House Architectural Visualization
Chief X5
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03-30-2013, 07:07 AM #9
Save the plan and close Chief.
Zip the file
Under this forum " go advanced" goto manage attachments
Click on the button, Add to DBX then up load.
If more than 2MB after zip --- use dropbox -- free.
As to sill - it doesn't because its just a molding. reports as window sill -- 1x
IMHO: since this is a monoslab -- slab extends to edge of footing, --- 25 sq. m reasonable for mesh
rebar is for footing. allowing for overlap - reasonable at 40.36. Concrete cal incudes slab, footing, chamfer and wall all in pour 1 ( somewhat misnamed). @ 5.51 close
rebar list as imperial -- should be metric #13. -- Chief still considers monoslab to have 100mm wall at ends and is counting it with rebar , in effect, double counting both mesh and rebar. Also it does appear that wall vs slab is also double counted. Chief refuses to release any formulas used so its hard to tell.Last edited by gteacher; 03-31-2013 at 02:03 AM.
Gerry
NewCraft Home Services
Design/ Compliance Review
PE, X6 , Sketchup 8, TurboCad Pro 20
-----------------------------------
ASUS P9X79D, i7-3820, GTX680 w/4gb
-----------------------------
If the Government would just cut down more d*** trees, I'd have a much better view of the forest.
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03-30-2013, 07:54 PM #10
Ed, I used to do Quantity take off by hand for years for builders.
I don't think CA Admin are really that interested in ML.
They focus on the 3d rendering & Drafting side of the program.
keep trying you might get noticed.
I also have the impression that if they got the ML working that they are worried about SCS (Suing Crazy Society).
Disclaimer's are not enough they need a legal document to protect themselves, then they might fix ML significantly?Last edited by Justice; 03-30-2013 at 07:56 PM.
Manuel Trantalis.
1999 V6 to X5 2012.
Dell XPS 630i Q9400@2.66GHz,
Twin NVIDIA GeForce 9800 GT,
8GB Ram, 64bit Windows 7 Pro.
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03-30-2013, 08:46 PM #11
I also have the impression that if they got the ML working that they are worried about SCS (Suing Crazy Society).
Disclaimer's are not enough they need a legal document to protect themselves, then they might fix ML significantly?
Justice:
huh ???
if anything, they would want the ML to be "correct"
by touting a tool that has major flaws someone may want to sue
if they order to much or too little or miss something that should have been ordered
thus causing delays
what kind of legal document are you referring to? that's what disclaimers are - legal documents
LewLew Buttery
Castle Golden Design - "We make dreams visible"
Lockport, NY
716-434-5051
www.castlegoldendesign.com
lbuttery at castlegoldendesign.com
CHIEF X5 (started with v9.5)
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03-31-2013, 07:22 AM #12
Lew:
Not sure I agree with you entirely.
Concrete Slab Footing and slab calculations are definitely wrong and apparently have been. Doesn't make much difference on residential housing but would on large project. Doesn't seem to bother Chief now and I expect they won't change. That says something? OTOH, maybe their disclaimer is "air tight".Last edited by gteacher; 03-31-2013 at 08:09 AM.
Gerry
NewCraft Home Services
Design/ Compliance Review
PE, X6 , Sketchup 8, TurboCad Pro 20
-----------------------------------
ASUS P9X79D, i7-3820, GTX680 w/4gb
-----------------------------
If the Government would just cut down more d*** trees, I'd have a much better view of the forest.
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03-31-2013, 10:28 AM #13
Gerry:
we are in agreement
I was countering the points Justice tried to make
LewLew Buttery
Castle Golden Design - "We make dreams visible"
Lockport, NY
716-434-5051
www.castlegoldendesign.com
lbuttery at castlegoldendesign.com
CHIEF X5 (started with v9.5)
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04-01-2013, 04:30 PM #14
Lew,
My conclusions are based on discussions from other posts about ML improvements made by CA administration staff.
I don't want to argue with you, that's just the impression I got right or wrong, it should clear up in time.
More important is 3d BIM with CA, they don't think its a priority or not many of us will need it.
With 3d BIM we can get our models taken off by other estimating software or, if no 3d BIM, please fix up ML and make it accurate.
Get a legal document disclaimer maybe, that the take off list even though accurate to some point may not cover all the individual components of a building, since that depends on the level of completion of the BIM model.
I am not a lawyer but that may need to be looked at, before we get more commitment to ML improvements?Manuel Trantalis.
1999 V6 to X5 2012.
Dell XPS 630i Q9400@2.66GHz,
Twin NVIDIA GeForce 9800 GT,
8GB Ram, 64bit Windows 7 Pro.
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04-01-2013, 05:17 PM #15
With 3d BIM we can get our models taken off by other estimating software
Justice:
I think this is probably the better course
it would be nice if it could all be done in one package
but ???
LewLew Buttery
Castle Golden Design - "We make dreams visible"
Lockport, NY
716-434-5051
www.castlegoldendesign.com
lbuttery at castlegoldendesign.com
CHIEF X5 (started with v9.5)