x6 unique identifiers for each door or window while generating schedule- some musings

[kiwicad]

2 questions and a bit more:

on x4 or x5, is there a way to coax chief into labelling a door with a unique door label eg D1, D2..D6 instead of 'grouping' same size (internal) doors together and labelling them
the same designator (eg 6 doors all labelled 'D1' as they are all the same size for example).
ditto for windows?

Also, once you place/generate a door or window schedule on the .plan, is there a way to add new doors/windows to that .plan file and appending them to the bottom of the existing
schedule without altering the existing already labelled doors/windows? (eg without having to auto generate the whole window schedule again as chief algorithm will typically label an existing window with a different designator upon 2nd time round with the re-auto generate sequence.)
I guess you could say how do you 'lock' existing designators? or assign that object as 'already designated'??

2 features for x6:

1. ideally I (not let chief) would like to specify the first designator on an object. (e.g. D1 as front door).
then I would like to see chief go clockwise round the perimeter of house labelling doors,
then go thru the house left to right.
then go upstairs.

same for windows.

2. one day, when it gets really smart, if chief would auto generate a 1 page window schedule which comprises of an exterior side elevation of each wall with dimensions of the windows/doors that would be swell. seems it can do it for internal cabinetry, so the code exists. just needs extending for external walls & windows / doors!.


cheers,
B

[billemery]

It's easy to do what you want with the schedule system now.

I'll post a plan a little later so you can see how I do it. All I have to do is tell Chief the sequence that I would like.

I like to go anti-clockwise around the house so that the number read from left to right in sequence in the elevations.

[billemery]

Here is the plan file.

Specify the Door sequence in the label column using the door dbx label tab to establish the order.

[Gene Davis]

So the answer is that, no, Chief cannot be coaxed to do what you want. But if you can be coaxed, as Bill has been, you can do it yourself.

Done with complete control, you get what you want. Sort of.

Still wishing for automatic? Not me, but I wish for greater manual control. Like specifying in a door's dialog that it be included in the window schedule, not the door schedule. Like being able to create a separate schedule for garage doors, rather than the simple go or no-go we get now to either include garage doors in the door schedule, or leave them out.

[billemery]

Gene,
I think the answer is yes to the questions that Kiwicad is asking. He can specify the doors in the order that he wants, and can add additional doors later at the end of the sequence.

I think that we will eventually see a sorting hierarchy that will allow this to happen automatically when the parameters have been set up.

For me, for now, I'm grateful that I can establish the order manually as it is not much of an effort. I look at it this way: I have to tell Chief the order that I want; or it will choose the order that is programmed by default.

Many users find the schedule system unusable, as there is little documentation on its flexibility.

[kiwicad]

thanks Bill I knew there are ways to use it built into chief x4/x5 (that are undocumented currently).
I havnt had the chance to explore the schedules thoroughly yet - hopefully x6 will improve (and document with videos etc) on the subtleties to the door and window schedules
while incorporating all of our 'must have' requirements so it becomes a nice component to use instead of an ugly hit and miss approach with too many overriding functions.

bernard
new zealand

[Dermot Dempsey]

...but I wish for greater manual control. Like specifying in a door's dialog that it be included in the window schedule, not the door schedule. Like being able to create a separate schedule for garage doors, rather than the simple go or no-go we get now to either include garage doors in the door schedule, or leave them out.

FYI.

You can already create a door schedule that includes only garage doors and make another one excluding them. Just open the door schedule dialog and check the appropriate "Objects to Include" options.

You can already put glass sliding doors on the window schedule and remove them from the door schedule. It would be nice if you could do this for other doors too. You should send this in as a suggestion.

[billemery]

Well, this question has got me thinking about schedule sequencing in general again.

I like using discrete window and door numbers as I have demonstrated in the posts above, but I've been thinking about the sequencing problem for those of us who report our windows and doors in feet and inches.

Below is a link for a related post that shows how to report window and door size in ascending order in the schedule. The 2'-10" door or window has always been reported out of sequence.
http://www.chieftalk.com/showthread....uence-solution

[Dermot Dempsey]

...is there a way to coax chief into labelling a door with a unique door label eg D1, D2..D6 instead of 'grouping' same size (internal) doors together and labelling them
the same designator (eg 6 doors all labelled 'D1' as they are all the same size for example).

The short answer to this is yes. All you need to do is make sure that some part of the data displayed in the schedule is unique. One way to do this is to display the label in the schedule and make sure the label is unique for each object.

This is not really very automatic though. Chief was designed to always group objects because the original programmers were told that this was how people wanted to do it. So this brings up some questions...

Why don't you want to group the objects?

Are there other people here that also don't want to group the objects?

Also, just as an FYI, we are currently looking at ways we can make it much easier to control the schedule ordering in X6. The grouping or not grouping question wasn't something we were really looking at so I need to figure out how important this is to people.

[pintodesign]

I'd like to have the option to have Chief give each door or window it's own unique label/number, (clockwise or counter-clockwise) without having to make changes for each individual window/door....and maybe also include in the schedule a dynamic link to what room it's located in. Would make them easier to find.
Thanks for bringing this up Bernard.
Barb

[bbbuilders]

I prefer not to have doors and windows grouped by size, and prefer to have each window/door listed on its own. As projects become more complex and the number of doors and windows increase having grouped objects can be confusing. Being able to work through the window or door schedule and plan in an organized order with unique numbers verses jumping around based on size helps to ensure that nothing is missed. Lets say I have a bank of 6 windows, I want to show these 6 windows with consecutive numbers (W105, W106, W107, ...... W112, W113) however if they are grouped by size, they could potentially be any number and probably will not be in any order that makes sense. Being able to choose which column we want to sort by would also be nice.

I currently specify doors (D101, D102 ....) and windows (W101, W102, ...) with a unique label which works pretty good, but they do not always sort correctly in the schedule and I am not sure why. I also use the label number to specify and group doors and windows by floor - 001 ... for basement 101 ... main floor and 201 ... 2nd floor.

[billemery]

Hi Dermot,
As with almost anything else in the building industry, there are different approaches to schedules.

One very popular approach which chief does reasonably well is grouping doors and windows by ascending size. This is popular with window and door suppliers because they can readily see size, type and quantity. The problem with Chief's schedules for those of us who use the industry standard foot inch system is that a 2'-10" door or window will report before a 2'-2", a 2'-6" and a 2'-8" which makes the schedule seem random to inexperienced users. The large problem with this system is its apparent lack of coherence when looking at the plans or elevations. A window W02, can be sitting next to a W37, but far from a W01, or W03.

A system that address this failing is a system where each window or door has a discrete number. I like to number counter clockwise around the building so that the numbers follow consecutively from left to right in the elevations. This makes it easy for the builder to see where the next window will go. I will generally number the interior doors from right to left, grouping doors in a logical fashion with numbering consistency in a hallway or a suite. I may group my closet doors, or pocket doors together if it aids clarity in the drawing. Chief allows me to do this by assigning a unique number in the label column where it looks first to sort. This method is a little time consuming, so it would be nice to have a tool that is similar to the "make same as" tool where I could just click around the plan to set the order.

Chief's scheduling system is quite adaptable, but poorly documented. It's also an area that is user hostile; the entire component system, and adding columns to the schedule are not at all intuitive.

I'd like to see better implementation of Ruby in the schedule system. for example: I'd like to be able create a column for wall thickness and draw that information into the schedule by way of the window or doors object properties. Doors are generally bought prehung, and the schedule is incomplete without the wall thickness. Windows are also dependent on the wall thickness for their jamb extensions, or surrounds.

[kenoeightspot]

I agree with Bill Emery

[Ron Ravenscroft]

I agree with Bill Emery

ME 2. It seems that this has been kicked around for far to long.

[Joe Carrick]

I think everyone knows how I feel about this subject. I'm amazed that none of the previous rantings by numerous posters on these forums has been taken seriously. The same suggestions come up time after time and nothing is done.