Details Comments for using connectors

**geocoy** · 06-22-2012, 01:20 PM

On my drawings I am required to specify the use of connectors - beam to beam, post to beam, truss to beam, hangers. I looked thru all of the in stock details and I could not find one that addresses the use of connectors.

Did I miss seeing it or is the topic not covered. Seems like it would be, conectors are very commonly used.

Can you guys help?

Thanks for the help..as always

**dhowardaia** · 06-22-2012, 01:31 PM

Simpson has a ton of details you could import http://www.strongtie.com/drawings/

Be aware, you need to know which connectors to use, based on the loads. Your engineer should specify the connectors

D

**gawdzira** · 06-22-2012, 01:46 PM

Uhhh, let me state what I believe Dorothy is not saying because she is polite and giving you the benefit of the doubt.

If you do not have an engineer on this project that is calling for connectors it is time to involve an engineer. This is the voice of reason talking. This is your dad's voice talking. This is the voice of someone who sat through a semester long class dedicated to construction failures. This is the voice that is not afraid to speak through his shoe when he puts his foot in his mouth...

**geocoy** · 06-22-2012, 03:45 PM

I think the only place we are using connectors is for floor joist to rim joist. My contractor will end up choosing what he wants to use, I just need to illustrate what he intends to use.

Thanks D and everyone else ofcourse.

**Alaskan Son** · 06-22-2012, 03:56 PM

Originally Posted by gawdzira

Uhhh, let me state what I believe Dorothy is not saying because she is polite and giving you the benefit of the doubt.

If you do not have an engineer on this project that is calling for connectors it is time to involve an engineer. This is the voice of reason talking. This is your dad's voice talking. This is the voice of someone who sat through a semester long class dedicated to construction failures. This is the voice that is not afraid to speak through his shoe when he puts his foot in his mouth...

You seem to get rather offensive toward people when engineering gets brought up. Saw it in another thread recently. You make it sound like everyone is a moron.

The OP never gave any hint that an engineer wasn't going to be involved.

I don't know how it works where you live, but in my experience, the engineer doesn't draw much of anything. Just provides the calculations, necessary specifications, and verifies that everything drawn up is correct. From what you make it sound like, we should all be sending a blank page and a description of what we're going to do to the engineer to draw up.

**redwood** · 06-22-2012, 07:35 PM

There are many basic connections that do not necessarily require a engineer. Some maybe, but not always.

**joey3032** · 06-22-2012, 10:03 PM

If you do not have an engineer on this project that is calling for connectors it is time to involve an engineer.

For those of you out west, perhaps you are not aware of how the "other world" get things built, but in 20 years of designing and building, I can count on one hand hand how many times I have hired an engineer to consult on a residential project. We dont deal with seismic issues, no strange wind loads, reasonable snow loads, and no hurricane ties.

**lbuttery** · 06-23-2012, 01:49 AM

if one follows the IRC/ibc codes then engineering shouldn't be necessary

it is the equivalent of going to the pharmacy and buying over the counter meds after having self-diagnosed the symptoms

this methaphor was provided by an ICC committee member at a training class I attended on the wall bracing codes

Lew

**dhowardaia** · 06-23-2012, 06:53 AM

Geocoy's post specifically refers to "beam-to-beam" connections. I don't know of any beams tables, other than uniformly loaded floor girders, in the IRC or any other code. There is a HUGE difference in the load capacities of various beam and joist hangers, so "letting the contractor pick what he wants to use" sounds pretty dicey to me. If there are beams, it is required that there be an engineer that is stamping the plans.

Dorothy

**perryh** · 06-23-2012, 08:03 AM

Dorothy is correct those beams need to be calculated for size, you can't just pick one that looks good. These are the problems we had during just about every earthquake we have ever had. New earthquake= new changes to codes. You East Coasters better get use to it, its coming your way. We learn from our mistakes.

**Alaskan Son** · 06-23-2012, 11:43 AM

You don't have to be a genius to calculate beam sizes or proper hanger sizes. Having an engineer look over the plans is great, but not necessary in order to draw the preliminary plans. There are so many different beam and hardware possibilities I find its usually better to draw it up how I want it and if the engineer sees something that needs changing than he/she will say so. Its not always the best practice to start with the engineer and then ask them to do it differently. Its just counterproductive.

Draw it is good as you can within you capabilities and then hand it off.

**perryh** · 06-23-2012, 01:07 PM

Originally Posted by Alaskan Son

You don't have to be a genius to calculate beam sizes or proper hanger sizes. Having an engineer look over the plans is great, but not necessary in order to draw the preliminary plans. There are so many different beam and hardware possibilities I find its usually better to draw it up how I want it and if the engineer sees something that needs changing than he/she will say so. Its not always the best practice to start with the engineer and then ask them to do it differently. Its just counterproductive.

Draw it is good as you can within you capabilities and then hand it off.

Thats what I do. The problem is the cities want stamped calculations to go with every plan around here.

**Jay M** · 06-23-2012, 05:28 PM

Originally Posted by perryh

Dorothy is correct those beams need to be calculated for size, you can't just pick one that looks good. These are the problems we had during just about every earthquake we have ever had. New earthquake= new changes to codes. You East Coasters better get use to it, its coming your way. We learn from our mistakes.

You're preaching to this east coast choir. I live in a 110 mph wind zone and some areas are even 120. Both can contain the added benefit of being in the windborne debris area as well......It's a hoot!!

I do all of my own sizing of beams, joists, rafters, footings and connectors. I also worked under a structural engineer for 4 years though. It certainly isn't rocket science.

**William H Lynch** · 06-23-2012, 07:38 PM

The law states:

'A design professional’s stamp confirms that the document was personally prepared by, or prepared under the direct supervision of, a specific individual, and that that individual has accepted complete
responsibility for the information contained in the stamped document'.

The law seems kind of vague as to what point you are under their direct supervision. This is why you need to find an engineer and develop a good working relationship with them. If you don't, then you may find your 'preliminary' time and effort worthless...

**lbuttery** · 06-24-2012, 02:14 AM

Bill:

which state is that from ???

here in NY every page has to follow that type of law

in VA/MD/DC only the pages the engineer is responsible for have to follow that type of law

so we do our pages -engineer does their's and the builder merges them and submits for permit

Lew

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