Getting arched windows right (V10)

[jonathank]

Thanks for being "transparent," Jonathan.

What's that suppose to mean?!

[jonathank]

Here's the much awaited for fixed plan.

I shouldn't even post it here, because of the last comment by Gene, but
since Curt was curious also...

The key is that you have to make it an octogonal arch first, and then that
will allow you to resize it accordingly.

But...I must say that all credit needs to go to Louis. He's the one that
has been walking me through the V10 fix.

He sure does know his way around CA

P.S. That "Arizona Hip" tutorial is FANTASTIC!

[Gene Davis]

Meant in jest, Jonathan. I shoulda used a smiley.

Your post #9 gave me the impression you had done the V.10 solution workout. You then went "transparent" and gave us the total scoop, that you had another source, a Chiefer correspondent using V.10, who did the work-out.

We still anxiously await the information.

[jonathank]

But I never said that I had done it...did I?

Therefore you were assuming. And everyone knows what assuming does
now don't they

[Gene Davis]

Well, that is great, Jonathan. My hat is off to Louis for providing the solution, and to you for communicating it.

That one belongs in the "department of sneaky tricks." Who would ever know that doing the octagon arch is the way to "break through" Chief's arch-drop stop? Only someone with the tenacity of Louis, I guess.

Lemme ask this.

Does X2 have the same weird behavior, in that you need to do the octagon first?

If it does, is the workaround explained in any SSA training vid?

[jonathank]

Gene,

As I explained earlier, I could do the window w/o a hitch in X2.

So they must have changed something between V10 and X2.

Just another reason to upgrade, I guess...

[Gene Davis]

Did some further study here, and found that weirdness abounds.

Downloaded the returned file, which I believe Louis worked with to "fix" the window, and found, upon examination, that,

1. While the sequence of doing OCTAGONAL arch so as to "force" down the springline for then doing a curved-top arch works, there is no control over the "drop," i.e., the elevation of the springline.

2. Any attempt at changing the springline, up or down, will make the arch "snap" back to the 12-11/16" drop.

3. Trying to do muntins, if you place a 2x2 line arrangement (one vert and one horiz muntin) in each square window before doing the grouping block, you lose the horizontals in the flankers when going into the OCT-ROUNDTOP sequence.

4. You can not unblock the window and retain the shapes, so as to be able to do manual (CAD>BLOCK>LOAD) muntins for the windows. Unblocking the unit returns the windows to their square shapes.

[Curtis Johnson]

Jonathan/Gene:

I guess I wasn't made out to be a detective ... even with good evidence. I opened the plan, found the window, and couldn't detect where/how an octagon arch was or had been used to get past the 12-11/16" barrier. And, I am using X2, and NO, I am not smoking anything. Do I sleep at night ... with both eyes and one ear open. Give me a clue ... besides the ones I missed!!!

[Gene Davis]

Curt, I can only speak about this from a V.10.08.a perspective.

In that version of Chief, do this. Place a window in a wall, then change it to a square with dimension 25-3/8". Doublehung, casement, awning, it does not matter.

Copy it twice then ram them together tight with zero between. Block your triple.

Open the blocked trip for spec, click the ARCH tab, then select OCTAGON as your arch type.

Now, still with the ARCH tab open, re-select the arch type as ROUND TOP. You will get the result, that being a broken arch with drop of 22-5/16", and no way to control that drop.

What you'll notice if you remain in the ARCH tab and select other options, is some interesting behavior.

[Curtis Johnson]

Gene:

I have done that ... many times ... and tried lots of other combinations of things and can't getting anything close to having an arched top with a springline close to the bottom. With 3 sq. side x side x side windows blocked and then "octoganized" I get the short sides desired but as soon as I click on broken arch, the dastardly 12-11/16" barrier re-asserts itself. Maybe I need to find Allen and go have a beer? I am not sure what other odd behavior you are speaking of ... when I can't get something to work right, IT IS ALL "ODD" or "UNUSUAL" BEHAVIOR!!! And NO, it couldn't be ME????

[Curtis Johnson]

I just re-read your post ... I clicked Broken Arch before ... so I went back and clicked on Roundtop Arch instead and it (CA X2) "converted" it to a Broken Arch. Now why did it do that? Maybe we need a convenient way to set radius' for arched windows that works differently than what we presently have???

I am keeping you from your work .... maybe I will see the light and get this figured out?

[Curtis Johnson]

Gene:

Did you find that little glitch on one of your exterior wall corners by the left side of your walkout patio area. The side wall sticks out a wee bit past the corner. I noticed an unusual line in an elevation view when I was looking at the windows.

[Gene Davis]

Thanks, Curt. That was a misplaced invisible wall that did that.

I think it is quite strange that you cannot replicate this arch thing. Have you done it using the sizes I gave?

[Curtis Johnson]

Gene:

Yup ... I used your sizes exactly. I am not sure what sort controls CA has built into the programming of those windows functions but it seems we should be able to have more control. Maybe there's a good reason for the behavior we are seeing .... ???

[Chad Cardin]

Wow thanks for a great thread! I was working on the same exact thing yesterday and I just deleted my three windows because the arch looked absolutely ridiculous! This solves it!

Not to change topics but is there a way to do the same thing but instead of having the center piece a window have double doors with a window on each side, mull it together and then have them all arched? This was the next complication I was running into on that project??

You both were a great help, thanks for asking the question!!