“Fit to Page” or “Print to Scale”

[spencerdesign]

I hope I am not boring some of you but I have my doubts that ART actually asked users about the “fit to page” decision as a print default. I can think of no benefit to having "fit to page" as a default, except maybe fewer calls to Tech Support on the part of trainees. I may find myself standing corrected. Please weigh in.

Thanks,

Sam

[frwillia]

IMO the best answer isn't on the list: Make it a user selectable "default". I.e. let the user set it where they want it and have it stay at that setting unless changed by the user.

Fitch

[mbmcphate]

Print to scale or user default setting

[Gary Doski]

The default works! why change it?

Letting users set the default would not be a problem for experienced users. But a newbie might get tangled here.

[frwillia]

Originally posted by Gary Doski
The default works! why change it?

If I could set it to "print to scale" and have it stay, I'd not have to set it again. I almost never print "fit to page". So, for me at least, it would be one less chance for a misprint.

Fitch

[Larry Kumpost]

When you realize that the default of fit to page can (in many cases) give you a print that is not to scale It seems to me that is the wrong message to send to a new user.

Having to change that setting each time you print is a real pain. I don't care how it is set "out of the box" but I would like it to hold the setting I use.

[louis]

I think it makes sense to hold the setting as well.

[shanek]

We should be able to control ALOT more items in Chief, I agree with this thread, we should be in control!!!! Just like all those **** warning dbx's, I want them all shut off!!! I've been using Chief since 1992 ver 2.0. I want more control over roofs and truss' but that will come in time or I will keep cheating and bypassing the system as needed. shane

[Doug Park]

I appreciate the feedback on this.

The decision we made was based on the following considerations.

1) Page Setup will normally be set to the printer that you wish to print your final output on and you will select the correct paper and sheet size for your final output. In this case "Fit to Paper" and "Print to Scale" are identical.

2) It is common to want to print a check plot on smaller paper, likely this will be 8 1/2 x 11 on an alternate printer. In this case "Fit to Paper" is the correct choice.

3) If you are using a print service or even if you are not, it is common that you will want to print directly to a PDF. This allows the option of having both a portable electronic snapshot form of your plan that you can e-mail, archive, and take to print service. In this case the normal situation is to select a PDF printer driver as your default with the correct paper selected in Page Setup. Printing unscaled check plots and final output would then be done from the PDF viewer.

4) We also recognized that no matter how well we design the user interface to minimize plotting to an incorrect scale by accident, it will always be possible, and likely probable that this will happen. For example, if you print to a PDF first and then print from the PDF viewer, the PDF viewer can cause rescaling to occur. We added the %scale text macro to aid in verifying that your output, when originally printed from Chief is at the desired scale.

5) We have limited resources and a requirement to produce a product in a timely manner so that you as customers and we as a business are both successful. This requires that we make some compromises. In this case we weighed the value of rewriting the print dialog vs. making minimal changes to it and focusing the savings in time on other areas. Our decision was that other areas needed more attention.

6) This dialog is also used in other views, like plan, elevation, cad details, and vector overviews, where "Fit to Paper" is more likely the desired behavior.

Taking all of these considerations together we came to the conclusion that "Fit to Paper" was a reasonable default. Perhaps our logic is flawed. If so I welcome your feedback.

In the future we will need to improve the print dialog in many ways. One area is to allow more items in it to have user preferences. Likely these would need to be on a per view type basis. Another important item is to make selection of the paper you wish to print on directly accessible on the print dialog. A print preview in the dialog would also be valuable. The ability to choose to print any set of specific pages is also a frequent request.

[quickdraw]

Doug,
I can see that a lot of thought went into your considerations but unfortuanately - very little actual drafting experience.

This is because most of us never ever want a print that is not "to scale". I print many many times in the course of a job. Often, this is because due to various limitations of the dimensioning tools in Chief, I must print out to scale in order to find a particular dimension.

For every plan I do in Chief I must print out dozens of "check prints" that are to scale.

If I had a nickle for every time I had to click that "to scale" button I could have paid for the entire program by now.

Of all the things I have to do in Chief to get a set of plans this is the silliest and really demonstrates how little the designers at CA actually understand about the work-a-day world your customers are in.

The "Fit to page", the stacked windows, and that ****ed Living Area are my votes for the most annoying problems.

[Doug Park]

To be clear:

The only time you need to choose "Print to Scale" to get "to scale" output is when you are either A) printing to paper that is smaller than your selected sheet size or B) printing to paper that is larger than your selected sheet size.

In case A) you will get multiple sheets with crop marks such that you can cut and tape the sheets together if desired. (I did this once and found it to be a very tedious process with less than ideal results).

In case B) the output will be centered on the paper.

Am I missing something more fundamental here?

Could you clarify what you mean by stacked windows?

A fix for the living area problem is currently being tested internally.

[ambrozac]

Thank you Doug. You've made it easier for me, the way I use it. I did not know that which you just explained. However, if you never use "fit to page" and have either case A or case B, you would always want the default set to "print to scale". At least that's what I'm getting from this thread, that most would like to set the default themselves if that's possible. But, that may not work because of the Page Setup?

[WendyWelton]

I would prefer that Print to Scale be the default. If somebody misses changing the setting, the results of the error are less serious - perhaps some wasted paper, as opposed to publishing drawings that a contractor, against all warnings, will scale...

W

[Tony Marshall]

Print to scale is the go for a default. If you have a single tray CAD printer like me ( Canon i9950 ) loaded with A3 then check plots or perspective views are nearly always sent to the A4 laser which is chosen from the printer list.

[DARREN]

Print to scale is by far the better choice as a default until the print window is up for re-design in the future.